Author Topic: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?  (Read 7274 times)

AlanSummers

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Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« on: May 01, 2015, 06:30:37 AM »
.

I'm opening this up so that registered members of the The Haiku Foundation forum, and unregistered people interested in haiku can read our comments.

It's easy to register if you see the top band of the THF webpage, or you can contact me via my email if you'd just wish me to post your questions or examples.

So, here you can post your questions about whether haiku require headnotes or footnotes even, or if they should be developed into haibun instead.

Here is just a very simple and short description of haibun from me:

Quote
Haibun are prose pieces in numerous styles from journalistic writing, diary entries, prose poetry, long fiction through to flash fiction, that usually include one or more haiku within the body of prose or starting or concluding a body of prose. - Alan Summers

Over time I'll post some examples, but for now, I'd welcome useful posts for both newcomers to haiku, those who feel they are not quite advanced, but mostly for all of us who wish to learn.

For anyone who isn't registered, and unsure, or who would like me to consider posting their comments until they are registered, email me:

[email protected]


RE Registering
The THF Forums are very friendly and inclusive places.  If you wish to consider registering here's a direct link:   

And if you wish to register:
http://www.thehaikufoundation.org/forum_sm/index.php?action=login

warmest regards,

Alan

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Betty Shropshire

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2015, 09:10:20 AM »
Hi Alan,

I'm not sure.  I created a monoku in the beginner section about 'mantle rock' and did not specify that it was also a certified national historic site on the Trail Of Tears.  I did submit it to a publication along with other monokus...one was accepted (hooray!!) but not that one.  And now I am wondering if a heading or author's note might have leant that one more credence or generated more depth??
Given the international community, maybe these headings are a necessity.  Personally, I like trying to figure out the intent and enjoy having to do research when faced with a 'huh?'

Respectfully,
Betty 

AlanSummers

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2015, 09:35:42 AM »
Hi Betty,
Hi Alan,

I'm not sure.  I created a monoku in the beginner section about 'mantle rock' and did not specify that it was also a certified national historic site on the Trail Of Tears.  I did submit it to a publication along with other monokus...one was accepted (hooray!!) but not that one.  And now I am wondering if a heading or author's note might have leant that one more credence or generated more depth??
Given the international community, maybe these headings are a necessity.  Personally, I like trying to figure out the intent and enjoy having to do research when faced with a 'huh?'

Respectfully,
Betty

I certainly agree that a reader nowadays ought to know more general knowledge, and anything outside that is easily remedied by a few seconds of looking it up on the internet.

You could always make it into a short prose and haiku piece by making the note at the head of the haiku into a title.  Or enclose a footnote that can be published at the discretion of the editor.

Perhaps it could be gathered into an extended prose piece with a haiku, so it becomes a haibun maybe?

Do you have a photograph too, so you can combine the short prose text, and haiku, into a shahai?

warm regards,

Alan

p.s.

Thanks for being the brave one to start the discussion going, and I hope others have questions, and examples too. :)

Betty Shropshire

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2015, 01:17:09 PM »
Hi Betty,
Hi Alan,

I'm not sure.  I created a monoku in the beginner section about 'mantle rock' and did not specify that it was also a certified national historic site on the Trail Of Tears.  I did submit it to a publication along with other monokus...one was accepted (hooray!!) but not that one.  And now I am wondering if a heading or author's note might have leant that one more credence or generated more depth??
Given the international community, maybe these headings are a necessity.  Personally, I like trying to figure out the intent and enjoy having to do research when faced with a 'huh?'

Respectfully,
Betty

I certainly agree that a reader nowadays ought to know more general knowledge, and anything outside that is easily remedied by a few seconds of looking it up on the internet.

You could always make it into a short prose and haiku piece by making the note at the head of the haiku into a title.  Or enclose a footnote that can be published at the discretion of the editor.

Perhaps it could be gathered into an extended prose piece with a haiku, so it becomes a haibun maybe?

Do you have a photograph too, so you can combine the short prose text, and haiku, into a shahai?

warm regards,

Alan

p.s.

Thanks for being the brave one to start the discussion going, and I hope others have questions, and examples too. :)

You're welcome!

No photograph.  But possibly a haibun could arise as my original intent had to do more with the rocks in the earth's mantle and their special quality of producing water, ie.  "sweating out" but it took on a different  life.
Seems that I  am more destined to write haibun as a result of trying to clarify a particular haiku.   
Anyway, I look forward to hearing what others have to say.   My haiku background is terribly limited and I am eager to keep egg off my face!

Best regards,
Betty 

AlanSummers

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2015, 02:14:21 PM »
Hi Betty,

Hi Betty,
Hi Alan,

I'm not sure.  I created a monoku in the beginner section about 'mantle rock' and did not specify that it was also a certified national historic site on the Trail Of Tears.  I did submit it to a publication along with other monokus...one was accepted (hooray!!) but not that one.  And now I am wondering if a heading or author's note might have leant that one more credence or generated more depth??
Given the international community, maybe these headings are a necessity.  Personally, I like trying to figure out the intent and enjoy having to do research when faced with a 'huh?'

Respectfully,
Betty

I certainly agree that a reader nowadays ought to know more general knowledge, and anything outside that is easily remedied by a few seconds of looking it up on the internet.

You could always make it into a short prose and haiku piece by making the note at the head of the haiku into a title.  Or enclose a footnote that can be published at the discretion of the editor.

Perhaps it could be gathered into an extended prose piece with a haiku, so it becomes a haibun maybe?

Do you have a photograph too, so you can combine the short prose text, and haiku, into a shahai?

warm regards,

Alan

p.s.

Thanks for being the brave one to start the discussion going, and I hope others have questions, and examples too. :)

You're welcome!

No photograph.  But possibly a haibun could arise as my original intent had to do more with the rocks in the earth's mantle and their special quality of producing water, ie.  "sweating out" but it took on a different  life.
Seems that I  am more destined to write haibun as a result of trying to clarify a particular haiku.   
Anyway, I look forward to hearing what others have to say.   My haiku background is terribly limited and I am eager to keep egg off my face!

Best regards,
Betty

Who doesn't have egg on their faces. ;)

Haibun is an excellent next step, and I can't think of a better person to venture into new territory. :)

warm regards,

Alan

Nicole Andrews

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2015, 02:13:58 AM »
Hi Alan,

The example of Haibun that you give is comfortingly broad and worryingly broad...I took part in Ray Rasmussen's haibun forum for a while and my pieces were criticised ( in a good way ) for using a poetic or metaphoric tone. There seemed to be a strict editing of form to create a sombre, pared down, reportative type prose. Does this happen to be a matter of taste and convention or the model for what constitutes a ' good ' haibun? Perhaps I am the type of person whose creativity is crippled by other peoples boxes and I just need to write regardless of squeezing into genre?
 What is Shahai?? another definition to widen the box? I looked some up and they just looked like photo haiga to me...

Confused,
regards
Nicole
In small proportions
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And in short measures
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AlanSummers

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2015, 02:36:03 AM »
Hi Nicole,

Hi Alan,

The example of Haibun that you give is comfortingly broad and worryingly broad...

Worryingly broad? :)   It's up to the individual to find a subject and approach they want to develop, although it's healthy to be stretched and pushed as a writer too.


Quote
I took part in Ray Rasmussen's haibun forum for a while and my pieces were criticised ( in a good way ) for using a poetic or metaphoric tone.

Without seeing the pieces I can't tell what was the issue.  All I can say is that I've used various approaches to haibun, including prose poetry with haiku, and one piece has been multiple published by respected haiku magazines, also knowing it was previously published.  That piece is appearing in a new world anthology of haibun, along with some other examples, some outside the norm perhaps of other schools of thought.

Quote
There seemed to be a strict editing of form to create a sombre, pared down, reportative type prose.

That does sound like a particular school of thought.  I teach haibun regularly, both at With Words and at an American poetry organisation.   We move outside these approaches, and successfully so.

Quote
Does this happen to be a matter of taste and convention or the model for what constitutes a ' good ' haibun?

I don't subscribe to a school of thought, and encourage an individual's voice, even if it veers away and outside what is prescribed as haibun.  I've had a number of trailblazers across the haikai genres precisely because I advocate the individual's voice over what is defined as such and such.

Quote
Perhaps I am the type of person whose creativity is crippled by other peoples boxes and I just need to write regardless of squeezing into genre?

Welcome to my world!   I love new fresh voices!    Haikai literature has a long history of people keeping it fresh because they didn't follow someone else's rules.  The only rule of writing is good writing.   We don't subscribe to the rule of Fight Club. ;)


Quote
What is Shahai?? another definition to widen the box? I looked some up and they just looked like photo haiga to me...

Confused,
regards
Nicole

Shahai is the correct term because it means photograph + haiku. :)   Haiga is artwork to do with painting, and in modern times iPad paint software techniques etc...

I've just finished the first ever shahai course, and will run another one in the autumn.  The course involved three experts, one on photography, one on haiku, and one from a documentary background.  The work was awesome, and I hope some of this will get seen in online magazines over time. :)

warm regards,

Alan


Quote in full:
Hi Alan,

The example of Haibun that you give is comfortingly broad and worryingly broad...I took part in Ray Rasmussen's haibun forum for a while and my pieces were criticised ( in a good way ) for using a poetic or metaphoric tone. There seemed to be a strict editing of form to create a sombre, pared down, reportative type prose. Does this happen to be a matter of taste and convention or the model for what constitutes a ' good ' haibun? Perhaps I am the type of person whose creativity is crippled by other peoples boxes and I just need to write regardless of squeezing into genre?
 What is Shahai?? another definition to widen the box? I looked some up and they just looked like photo haiga to me...

Confused,
regards
Nicole

Nicole Andrews

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2015, 02:59:50 AM »
Hi Alan,

Thanks for mopping up the gravy...good to get clarification on shahai, I like to paint my own ( haiga ) rather than use photo's, I have found it near impossible to find interesting ' art ' haiga. The internet is limited in the treasures it displays and I find you still need to get lucky...or know the right links...the confusion lies with a need for validation from outside myself, that is the weed in my garden that needs pulling...have trowel...am digging.

Regards
Nicole
In small proportions
We just beauties see
And in short measures
Life may perfect be

Ben Jonson

setting fire to the landscape-
http://nicolethelocalartist.wordpress.com

AlanSummers

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2015, 03:20:11 AM »
Hi Nicole,
Hi Alan,

Thanks for mopping up the gravy...good to get clarification on shahai, I like to paint my own ( haiga ) rather than use photo's, I have found it near impossible to find interesting ' art ' haiga. The internet is limited in the treasures it displays and I find you still need to get lucky...or know the right links...the confusion lies with a need for validation from outside myself, that is the weed in my garden that needs pulling...have trowel...am digging.

Regards
Nicole

Regarding shahai, it refers to the person's own photographs, and photography is a skill in its own right.   I try to diplomatically persuade people on Facebook not to use other people's photographs.

Shahai is a fully integrated artwork, with the person using a well took photo, a crafted haiku, or tanka, and font choice positioned well and not just dropped onto the photo.

There is not a strong choice of well-crafted haiga, I must admit, but there are exceptions like Sandi Pray, and Ron Moss, to mention but two people.

You say:
...the confusion lies with a need for validation from outside myself, that is the weed in my garden that needs pulling...have trowel...am digging.

Do you mean from the public and/or peers giving you validation?  For instance I give only suggestions, and never rewrites, and the photographer we use has the same teaching skills, where none of us are judgemental, just offering our advice, but without the individual moving away from their own voice.

There does need to be some interaction with people as regards our artwork as it's a type of communication after all, and I've always been personally rewarded by overhearing the public talk about my work.  They don't know I'm the author at times, so it's unbiased. :)

warm regards,

Alan

Nicole Andrews

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2015, 04:02:07 AM »
Hi Alan,

I have used my own photography and haiku, I'm not brilliant at the text inclusion as I'm limited in my technology and find it frustrating to stamp software template writing onto the photo. Sandi Pray is one of the most interesting haiga artists that I've found. It would be interesting to see some British artists as the American approach is very different.
The validation issue comes about from the isolation of the studio and lack of peers, but particularly with haiga and haibun, which have particular criteria, meaning there is a right way and a wrong way...although skill in any genre is through dogged adherence and practice.

What I want to hear...note to self...YOU'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK, KEEP GOING !!!!!

Regards
Nicole
In small proportions
We just beauties see
And in short measures
Life may perfect be

Ben Jonson

setting fire to the landscape-
http://nicolethelocalartist.wordpress.com

AlanSummers

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2015, 04:31:51 AM »
Hi Nicole,

Hi Alan,

I have used my own photography and haiku, I'm not brilliant at the text inclusion as I'm limited in my technology and find it frustrating to stamp software template writing onto the photo. Sandi Pray is one of the most interesting haiga artists that I've found. It would be interesting to see some British artists as the American approach is very different.
The validation issue comes about from the isolation of the studio and lack of peers, but particularly with haiga and haibun, which have particular criteria, meaning there is a right way and a wrong way...although skill in any genre is through dogged adherence and practice.

What I want to hear...note to self...YOU'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK, KEEP GOING !!!!!

Regards
Nicole

That was one of the main features of the With Words shahai course:
http://area17.blogspot.co.uk/2015/01/shahai-combining-your-haiku-your.html

We had North American artists, one from England, and one from mainland Europe.  The English participant is also a student of mine where we meet up, and she hadn't been doing haiku for quite some time but she got herself back up to speed, and produced some startling work off of one of Karen's prompts.

I regularly produce shahai myself, often at NaHaiWriMo, and will put together a submission when I have more time.

Sandi does both haiga and shahai and I asked permission from her as we wanted her examples shown.  She grasps better than most people how to make everything work together.   You'll be blown away by the two North American writers though. :)

Have you considered curating your own photography exhibition that includes shahai as others have done?

I still think Western haiga, and shahai, and haibun are in their infancy.  As a Red Moon Anthology editor for many years (2000-2004) I witnessed a lot of work across the genres as I literally subscribed to every single subscription magazine, and read everything online too.   I don't know how many do that today, but it was very expensive to subscribe to every publication around the world, and incredibly time consuming, and to carry so much work in my head too, but it was worth it! :)

At that time haibun was male-dominated and the main practitioners I submitted for consideration were Arwyn Evans (Wales) and Michael McClintock (USA) followed by David Cobb (England) and Ken Jones (Wales).   Today I'd say the leading haibun writers are women, with Roberta Beary (USA) in particular.

I have seen powerful photography on my course, and hope to see equally strong work that gets the hair on my neck standing up! :)

warm regards,

Alan

Don Baird

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2015, 12:43:37 PM »
An interesting thread.  8)

A couple of links below regarding two of my photoku books:

http://en.calameo.com/read/001095372ef63fa75cb78   (Faces and Places - Los Angeles)

http://en.calameo.com/read/0010953728bd16e6aab8e  (L.A. Thru A Lens)

peace and blessings,

Don

ps ... as a side note, headnotes for haiku were common -- especially by Basho. Readers wouldn't have a clue as to what he was talking about if he did not include some headnotes with his haiku. He travelled extensively to places most readers hadn't seen. We'd be lost today without them.
I write haiku because they're there ...

through
the hole of a cheerio,
spring!

whitedove

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2015, 06:52:23 PM »
An interesting thread.  Just wanted to mention that Chen-ou Liu has some guidelines for writing Joshi, a headnote for your haiku on NeverEndingStory under the heading To The Lighthouse.  Rebecca Drouilhet

AlanSummers

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2015, 01:39:29 AM »
Regarding joshi, this is touched on here:

The Formation of Allusive Resilience in Waka and Its Relevance to Meiji Shintaishi
Dean A. Brink, Saint Martin's University
http://www.simplyhaiku.com/SHv4n2/reprints/Brink.html



Jan Benson

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Re: Headnotes for haiku or Haibun?
« Reply #14 on: September 12, 2015, 02:17:55 AM »
This has been informative, and I hope my delayed questions are not too late to be considered.

Moving through several threads before landing on this one, I too, notice a more lenient approach to the process of writing the Japanese forms in English, compared to American specific teachings. Especially structuring haiku, but also on the creation of haibun and haiga.

Perhaps in the USA, we are "industrialized" in most disciplines. We are easily qued up, and readily adapt to formations and formulas.
In this more rigid environment, breaking free of convention is a bit of a challenge, if rewarding.

Alan, I appreciate most your clarification regarding the placement of verse within the haiga or shahai, as I have seen the haiku placed underneath the artwork and photographs in some postings.

Question.
About three years ago I stopped in to look at postings on NaHaiWriMo, to find folks post at will, with occasional helpful feedback. Above, in your comments, you mention posting your work on that blog. I am hesitant to post there because I worry editors are watching, and may consider one's postings on the site to be "previously published" work.
Alan, can you speak to the benefits of participating on such an active site as NaHaiWriMo?
And any cautions you may offer?

Jan in Texas
---1st Prize_The Italian Matsuo Basho Award 2016 (Int'l Foreign Language)
---A Pushcart Nominated Poet, (haiku "adobe walls").
---"The poet is accessible, the poet is for everyone." Maya Angelou

 

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