Author Topic: Rules for Haiga  (Read 5261 times)

Lorraine Pester

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Rules for Haiga
« on: March 16, 2016, 08:19:40 AM »
I've looked all over this site for a simple statement concerning the rules for constructing a haiga. From other sources, I've gleaned this: The image/haiku are to complement, not explain each other. If you have an image of a door, the haiku should not be overtly referring to a door, for example.

I'd like to give haiga a try, using photographs. But I need a clearer statement on how to proceed. I've looked at the Haiga forum here and frequently see Alan saying that the image and the haiku are too close to each other. I assume that means that they are too similar?

Please and thank you.
Lorraine

AlanSummers

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2016, 08:56:38 AM »
Hi Lorraine,

THF started off focusing on haiku only, and then branched out into other haikai disciplines.

Haiga is a painting and a haiku, so I would say the rules are those of painting and those of haiku.

Combining a photograph with a haiku is shahai [photo+haiku].

If a photograph is good enough I don't see that a haiku should repeat it verbatim or in part.   Shahai and haiga are not ekphrastic exercises, but a coupling of two art forms that create a third one.

Haiku should be a peek outside or behind the frame holding a photograph or a painting.   Just like the Brussels method of introducing small mirrors to show something outside the painting.   Otherwise we risk writing mere descriptive captions and strap-lines as in advertising.


The Glass Mirror and the Renaissance
Art and Individuality
http://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/500284.html

The False Mirror:
https://zachbart.wordpress.com/2008/10/15/rene-magritte-the-false-mirror-1928/

Make sure that the words and the image refuse to speak to each other and see what happens.  :-)

Alan


I've looked all over this site for a simple statement concerning the rules for constructing a haiga. From other sources, I've gleaned this: The image/haiku are to complement, not explain each other. If you have an image of a door, the haiku should not be overtly referring to a door, for example.

I'd like to give haiga a try, using photographs. But I need a clearer statement on how to proceed. I've looked at the Haiga forum here and frequently see Alan saying that the image and the haiku are too close to each other. I assume that means that they are too similar?

Please and thank you.
Lorraine

AlanSummers

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2016, 09:09:25 AM »
"Art commences when artists stop representing simply what they are looking at, and begin representing what they are seeing.” J Kacian

Info on Haiga:
http://www.wapoets.net.au/mari-warabiny-haiku-group/info-on-haiga/

Looking and Seeing: How Haiga Works
Jim Kacian
http://www.gendaihaiku.com/kacian/haiga.html

Lorraine Pester

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2016, 11:41:08 AM »
Hi Alan,
I've glanced at your links; the glancing has inspired me to open my Aperture library and look at my minimalist photos in particular.

A question: It has been my habit to send my selected photos over to Photoshop, mainly to minimize elements and to make the photos more 'sketch-like.' The fact that they started life as a photograph still puts the completed image into the photograph category no matter what the end result-correct?

Like Arnold, I'll be back  8)

Lorraine

AlanSummers

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2016, 11:43:20 AM »
There are many ways to do a shahai as demonstrated on the courses I lead with a professional photograph and tutor.   Photograph as is or manipulated is fine, just attention to detail so that the image is good enough to show in an exhibition, and the same for the poem. :)

Hi Alan,
I've glanced at your links; the glancing has inspired me to open my Aperture library and look at my minimalist photos in particular.

A question: It has been my habit to send my selected photos over to Photoshop, mainly to minimize elements and to make the photos more 'sketch-like.' The fact that they started life as a photograph still puts the completed image into the photograph category no matter what the end result-correct?

Like Arnold, I'll be back  8)

Lorraine

Lorraine Pester

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2016, 11:54:55 AM »
There are many ways to do a shahai as demonstrated on the courses I lead with a professional photograph and tutor.   Photograph as is or manipulated is fine, just attention to detail so that the image is good enough to show in an exhibition, and the same for the poem. :)

Hi Alan,
I've glanced at your links; the glancing has inspired me to open my Aperture library and look at my minimalist photos in particular.

A question: It has been my habit to send my selected photos over to Photoshop, mainly to minimize elements and to make the photos more 'sketch-like.' The fact that they started life as a photograph still puts the completed image into the photograph category no matter what the end result-correct?

Like Arnold, I'll be back  8)

Lorraine


 :-*

Jan Benson

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2017, 08:58:13 PM »
Jeeze...
Alan and Lorraine:
How did I miss this!

Great resources here.
Glad for this Discussion!

Jan in Texas
« Last Edit: April 11, 2017, 07:53:29 PM by Jan Benson »
---1st Prize_The Italian Matsuo Basho Award 2016 (Int'l Foreign Language)
---A Pushcart Nominated Poet, (haiku "adobe walls").
---"The poet is accessible, the poet is for everyone." Maya Angelou

Seaview (Marion Clarke)

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2017, 04:46:06 AM »
Hi Alan,
I've glanced at your links; the glancing has inspired me to open my Aperture library and look at my minimalist photos in particular.

A question: It has been my habit to send my selected photos over to Photoshop, mainly to minimize elements and to make the photos more 'sketch-like.' The fact that they started life as a photograph still puts the completed image into the photograph category no matter what the end result-correct?

Like Arnold, I'll be back  8)

Lorraine

That's a very interesting question, Lorraine. I have noticed some photo haiku on the popular Japanese programme Haiku Masters look more like a piece of art than a photo because they have been digitally manipulated or had filters added. This made me consider combining some of my paintings with haiku, but then I thought "but that's a haiga, rather than a photo haiku." So it appears to be a thin line...

marion

Seaview (Marion Clarke)

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2017, 05:00:55 AM »
Jeeze...
Alan and Lorraine:
How did I miss this!

Great resources here.
Glad for this Discussion!

Jan in Texas

I too only spotted this thread quite recently, Jan (I know, I know, I need to get my act together on the forum! 😳)

I sent a couple of the links Alan posted to my son who is studying Advanced Art and is combining text with surrealism in some of the pieces he is working on. The interpretation of the Magritte painting and Jim Kacian's essay on haiga were of interest to him.

So many great resources - it's finding time to delve into them that's the problem.

marion

Jan Benson

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2017, 03:43:47 AM »
Marion:
On the blurring of photo and photo shopping for effect, I remember that She'll Shahai that Elaine submitted and the ORIGINAL comments by the Master Haijin were pointed towards her use of cosmetics to enhance the original photo, and YET? It was featured in the Expose of "found" Master Haiga experts, such as yourself.
Quite interesting. I thought.

Jan Benson
---1st Prize_The Italian Matsuo Basho Award 2016 (Int'l Foreign Language)
---A Pushcart Nominated Poet, (haiku "adobe walls").
---"The poet is accessible, the poet is for everyone." Maya Angelou

Seaview (Marion Clarke)

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2017, 03:14:15 PM »
I know the one you mean, Jan, as I think I mentioned to Elaine on Facebook how much I enjoyed the colour in it and her tulip shahai. But I don't remember the comments on it when it first appeared - perhaps it was before I became aware of Haiku Masters. Were they very negative about it?

marion
« Last Edit: May 01, 2017, 04:31:44 PM by Seaview »

Jan Benson

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2017, 09:47:06 AM »
It was the Japanese haijin who brought it up.
It was more of a long pause, a tilt of the head, and a direct comment that he recognised the alteration. It sort of just hung in the air. I do think the lady did comment too.

It was obvious and yet subtle.

Jan
---1st Prize_The Italian Matsuo Basho Award 2016 (Int'l Foreign Language)
---A Pushcart Nominated Poet, (haiku "adobe walls").
---"The poet is accessible, the poet is for everyone." Maya Angelou

Seaview (Marion Clarke)

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2017, 09:24:13 AM »
It was the Japanese haijin who brought it up.
It was more of a long pause, a tilt of the head, and a direct comment that he recognised the alteration. It sort of just hung in the air. I do think the lady did comment too.

It was obvious and yet subtle.

Jan

So there was no statement as to whether it was acceptable practice or not...interesting.

marion

Jan Benson

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2017, 01:21:14 PM »
Marion,
I know I felt like there was no positive or negative at the time... just remarks.

But Elaine is in the top winners for photo haiku, so it must be ok/good.

Jan
---1st Prize_The Italian Matsuo Basho Award 2016 (Int'l Foreign Language)
---A Pushcart Nominated Poet, (haiku "adobe walls").
---"The poet is accessible, the poet is for everyone." Maya Angelou

Seaview (Marion Clarke)

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Re: Rules for Haiga
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2017, 03:08:45 AM »
I wonder what they'll make of one I have just sent, Jan - it features my oil painting of bluebells in the Mourne Mountains. It looks like a painting rather than a photograph, but was taken with my iPad and I have left it completely untouched (not even an auto correct! ;D ) , so strictly speaking, it is a photo haiku even though it doesn't look like it!

marion

 

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